Technical Question Game - Page 9

rodgers · 11-17-2007, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by Speed_Demon

Mechanically how does a decompression valve work?

a lever (hopefully at the bars :D) is connected to a cable that opens the exhaust valves when pulled to allow a rider to more easily clear a flooded engine so that it can be started again.

question:

why do some auto manufacturers list 2 different spark plug numbers for the same engine?

Speed_Demon · 11-17-2007, 07:29 PM

Originally Posted by rodgers

a lever (hopefully at the bars :D) is connected to a cable that opens the exhaust valves when pulled to allow a rider to more easily clear a flooded engine so that it can be started again.

question:

why do some auto manufacturers list 2 different spark plug numbers for the same engine?

Not exactly. The valve is designed to release compression via one exhaust valve by opening it by a movable lobe on the cam. Close enough though it's been a couple hours lets move on.

Speed_Demon · 11-17-2007, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by rodgers

question:

why do some auto manufacturers list 2 different spark plug numbers for the same engine?

Are you talking heat ranges?

rodgers · 11-17-2007, 07:33 PM

no, not different options, but 2 different plugs listed. this is OEM listed, as in dealer, not schucks or aftermarket.

FastCat · 11-17-2007, 11:40 PM

Originally Posted by rodgers

question:

why do some auto manufacturers list 2 different spark plug numbers for the same engine?

Dual-plug head. The 240SX nissan is the example I'm thinking of.

question:
What was the first production motorcycle to use a 16-valve head on a liquid-cooled motor?

jwfzr · 11-17-2007, 11:47 PM

Originally Posted by FastCat

Dual-plug head. The 240SX nissan is the example I'm thinking of.

question:
What was the first production motorcycle to use a 16-valve head on a liquid-cooled motor?

1984 900 ninja?

What was the first production bike to use a 16 inch front tire?

rodgers · 11-17-2007, 11:47 PM

240sx does not have 2 plugs per cylinder. not what i was looking for. i'm looking for something that has to do with wastespark ignitions. i would take a stab at yours, but i honestly have no idea. i'm too young.

MichelinMan · 11-18-2007, 12:03 AM

Originally Posted by jwfzr

1984 900 ninja?

What was the first production bike to use a 16 inch front tire?

Are you looking for VFR? If so, go back in time and check out the (early 80's) Suzuki 750GS-ES series.

Why is it for car engines that torque and HP area always equal at 5250rpm?

rodgers · 11-18-2007, 12:07 AM

because hp is calculated. HP = (torquexrpm)/5252. 5252 is the constant (a result of a lot of stoichiometry.) where they are equal.

Motorcycle man · 11-18-2007, 12:08 AM

Originally Posted by MichelinMan

Are you looking for VFR? If so, go back in time and check out the (early 80's) Suzuki 750GS-ES series.

Why is it for car engines that torque and HP area always equal at 5250rpm?

I am not sure how technical you are wanting, but they cross as a result of the equation used to determine each.

Is that what you were wanting?

MichelinMan · 11-18-2007, 12:10 AM

Originally Posted by Motorcycle man

I am not sure how technical you are wanting, but they cross as a result of the equation used to determine each.

Is that what you were wanting?

Yup. Super simplistic question.

rodgers · 11-18-2007, 12:12 AM

Originally Posted by Motorcycle man

I am not sure how technical you are wanting, but they cross as a result of the equation used to determine each.

Is that what you were wanting?

torque is measure. HP is calculated :D

Motorcycle man · 11-18-2007, 12:19 AM

What was the first production bike to use ram air?

Speed_Demon · 11-18-2007, 03:09 AM

Originally Posted by Motorcycle man

What was the first production bike to use ram air?

92 Kawasaki ZX-12R. Although the Ducati 916 intake resembled ram air and would explain why it seems to pull just as hard on the top end as the bottom.

What are the two major reasons n2o increases hp? Why is extra fuel needed?

rodgers · 11-18-2007, 08:25 AM

the oxygen content in N20 is 36% whereas ambient air is only 21% so more potential there. more oxygen requires more fuel. not sure about your second reason.

and just incase anyone was wondering, cars that come OEM with wastespark ignitions and Platinum tipped spark plugs generally have different plug numbers becasue the platinum is only needed on one side of the current flow across the gap. so one plug on a coil will have it on the ground electrode, the other on the center electrode. saves manufacturers money if they dont need to put that tiny piece of platinum on both sides.

FastCat · 11-18-2007, 09:10 AM

Originally Posted by rodgers

the oxygen content in N20 is 36% whereas ambient air is only 21% so more potential there. more oxygen requires more fuel. not sure about your second reason.

and just incase anyone was wondering, cars that come OEM with wastespark ignitions and Platinum tipped spark plugs generally have different plug numbers becasue the platinum is only needed on one side of the current flow across the gap. so one plug on a coil will have it on the ground electrode, the other on the center electrode. saves manufacturers money if they dont need to put that tiny piece of platinum on both sides.

I call BS.

You're telling us that the polarity of the plugs is different? Impossible unless the cylinder-head is made from a non-conductive material. Waste-spark systems go all the way back to the 1969 CB750 Honda - perhaps earlier. It might be that there are different plugs specified due to materials being different, but I promise that it doesn't have anything to do with current-flow reversing directions (it can't).

...and the original 240SX in the `80's DID use a dual-plug head (so did the pickup-trucks of the same era).

...and you're correct about the N2O kinda - it's 36% oxygen by weight - but it also creates more power because of the cooling-effect on the intake-charge. If the system is designed properly you draw in additional atmosphere along with the N2O and also dramatically decrease the temperature in the intake-tract (-70ºF change is typical). Nitrous is also typically injected in a liquid state - so regardless of the oxygen-content advantage, it can pack a LOT more oxygen into the same space (which is why it needs additional fuel injected along with it).

..and yes, the 1984 Kawasaki 900cc "ninja" was the first production-bike to use a liquid-cooled, 16-valve poerplant.

...and I'm not sure if it was the first or not - but the 1983 GS-750E did use a 16" front wheel.

...and I *think* it was the ZX6 in the early 90's was the first production-bike with functional ram-air intake.

Does anyone know which was the first production bike to use EFI?

Motorcycle man · 11-18-2007, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by Speed_Demon

92 Kawasaki ZX-12R. Although the Ducati 916 intake resembled ram air and would explain why it seems to pull just as hard on the top end as the bottom.

What are the two major reasons n2o increases hp? Why is extra fuel needed?

Close, it was called the ZX-10 though, only 1000cc.

rodgers · 11-18-2007, 11:44 AM

ever used an ignition scope before? that is exactly what i'm saying. the polarity is different. you use 2 pickups and a trigger for wastespark systems. clamp all the positives, then all the negatives. the coil isnt grounded to the frame, it finds its path through the opposite plug back to its origin. the current doesnt "reverse" its flow, its how it always goes. automotive theory = from + to -.

rodgers · 11-18-2007, 11:45 AM

and the earliest 240sx i know of that we ever got in the states had a ka24 engine late 80's, and it did not have 2plugs per cyl. unless you're talking datsun L6's, in which case i dont know.

bubba_zenetti · 11-18-2007, 01:00 PM

Originally Posted by Speed_Demon

92 Kawasaki ZX-12R. Although the Ducati 916 intake resembled ram air and would explain why it seems to pull just as hard on the top end as the bottom.

What are the two major reasons n2o increases hp? Why is extra fuel needed?

well if you want to get technical, the first production bike to use ram air was the suzuki gt380 in 1972. although its ram air system was was named such, it was used to cool the cylinder head.

and actually the first production bike to use ram air as forced induction was the 1990 kawasaki zx11c1


11-17-2007, 07:33 PM	#164
rodgers Licensed Joined: Jan 2006 From: Lacey, WA I Ride: ktm 560smr	no, not different options, but 2 different plugs listed. this is OEM listed, as in dealer, not schucks or aftermarket. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter Last edited by rodgers; 11-17-2007 at 10:18 PM..


11-17-2007, 11:47 PM	#167
rodgers Licensed Joined: Jan 2006 From: Lacey, WA I Ride: ktm 560smr	240sx does not have 2 plugs per cylinder. not what i was looking for. i'm looking for something that has to do with wastespark ignitions. i would take a stab at yours, but i honestly have no idea. i'm too young. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


11-18-2007, 12:07 AM	#169
rodgers Licensed Joined: Jan 2006 From: Lacey, WA I Ride: ktm 560smr	because hp is calculated. HP = (torquexrpm)/5252. 5252 is the constant (a result of a lot of stoichiometry.) where they are equal. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


11-18-2007, 12:19 AM	#173
Motorcycle man Telemark Rider Joined: Jan 2006 From: Outer darkness . . . I Ride: Nothing for a while now (tear)	What was the first production bike to use ram air? __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


11-18-2007, 08:25 AM	#175
rodgers Licensed Joined: Jan 2006 From: Lacey, WA I Ride: ktm 560smr	the oxygen content in N20 is 36% whereas ambient air is only 21% so more potential there. more oxygen requires more fuel. not sure about your second reason. and just incase anyone was wondering, cars that come OEM with wastespark ignitions and Platinum tipped spark plugs generally have different plug numbers becasue the platinum is only needed on one side of the current flow across the gap. so one plug on a coil will have it on the ground electrode, the other on the center electrode. saves manufacturers money if they dont need to put that tiny piece of platinum on both sides. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter Last edited by rodgers; 11-18-2007 at 08:27 AM..


11-18-2007, 11:44 AM	#178
rodgers Licensed Joined: Jan 2006 From: Lacey, WA I Ride: ktm 560smr	ever used an ignition scope before? that is exactly what i'm saying. the polarity is different. you use 2 pickups and a trigger for wastespark systems. clamp all the positives, then all the negatives. the coil isnt grounded to the frame, it finds its path through the opposite plug back to its origin. the current doesnt "reverse" its flow, its how it always goes. automotive theory = from + to -. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter Last edited by rodgers; 11-18-2007 at 11:48 AM..


11-18-2007, 11:45 AM	#179
rodgers Licensed Joined: Jan 2006 From: Lacey, WA I Ride: ktm 560smr	and the earliest 240sx i know of that we ever got in the states had a ka24 engine late 80's, and it did not have 2plugs per cyl. unless you're talking datsun L6's, in which case i dont know. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

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