BMW forcing new S1K owners to 9000RPM redline for 600 miles

Avboden · 03-02-2010, 10:25 AM

yeah yeah, I made a thread other than that old one. This deserves it's own topic.

I've just found out that BMW is not releasing new S1000RRs from the dealers until a new fuel mapping has been delivered to the ECU. This will lower the redline to 9000RPM. This will then be removed when the bike hits around 600 miles.

Not quite sure what to make of this...I don't think it's that big of deal but it could point to a few things.

1. BMW is simply wanting to enforce engine break in.
or 2. BMW has already gotten warranty complaints on the engine (I haven't heard of ANY so I don't think this is likely) so they are using this as a precaution.

I've never heard of a manufacturer enforcing breakins like this. What say you? Personally I don't think it's too bad. You can still go like a bat out of hell to 9000RPM, and putting 600 miles on a bike takes 1, maybe 2 days.

discuss, and please keep the hating aside, this is new ground for manufacturers. Will we see others follow suit?

fastfoodfred · 03-02-2010, 10:28 AM

lets them out of warranty costs.....potentially.

Velociraptor · 03-02-2010, 10:33 AM

Well this is the highest performance engine out there for a liter bike and the first year so...... Anyway 9000rpm is pretty fast for the street.

koorbloh · 03-02-2010, 10:35 AM

Originally Posted by Avboden

yeah yeah, I made a thread other than that old one. This deserves it's own topic.

and please keep the hating aside,

next time, leave ^ this shit out of your post, you bring it on yourself with this type of shit.

Originally Posted by Avboden

I've just found out that BMW is not releasing new S1000RRs from the dealers until a new fuel mapping has been delivered to the ECU. This will lower the redline to 9000RPM. This will then be removed when the bike hits around 600 miles.

Not quite sure what to make of this...I don't think it's that big of deal but it could point to a few things.

1. BMW is simply wanting to enforce engine break in.
or 2. BMW has already gotten warranty complaints on the engine (I haven't heard of ANY so I don't think this is likely) so they are using this as a precaution.

I've never heard of a manufacturer enforcing breakins like this. What say you? Personally I don't think it's too bad. You can still go like a bat out of hell to 9000RPM, and putting 600 miles on a bike takes 1, maybe 2 days.

discuss, this is new ground for manufacturers. Will we see others follow suit?

^try posting more like this.

now, to answer your question, according to you, this is the first bike in the history of the world that has the software to enforce such things as a variable red line...so it makes sense to not do it before now.

but, it sounds more like a CYA maneuver to me than a proper break-in procedure...keeping the bike from peak horsepower for a few miles as users get used to the bike is probably a good thing.

from an engineering standpoint: it's more things to test and to have go wrong...it's gotta be a legal/marketing thing

vagrant · 03-02-2010, 10:46 AM

I guess that stunta dood's bike is in trouble then...

Anyhoo, I think its a smart business decision, given that the capability to enforce it is there for a few reasons:
(a) prevents the number of returned failed engines they are gonna see = less warranty costs and less bad press,
(b) likely reduces the number of noobs/non-noobs that kill themselves on the bike straight after they buy it = less bad press,
(vi) haven't thought this one through yet.

Ti954 · 03-02-2010, 10:49 AM

IB4A............awwwww crap!

strangerin · 03-02-2010, 10:49 AM

Because they can?
not like there are not recommendations from other mfd.

KevinD · 03-02-2010, 10:52 AM

Is the firmware update going to be covered under warranty, or will it be done at the owner's expense?

KevinD

theJrod · 03-02-2010, 10:53 AM

BMW did this with the e46 M3 as well. It wasn't a "forced" redline, but when the car was new the tach would flash yellow and red if rev'ed too high. Even after break-in, the car still did that until it was fully warmed up. Great idea, since warm-up is especially important for high performance engines.

The best way to break in an engine is on the dyno. BMW's engine doesn't do anything different than every other engine on the market. An engine is an engine is an engine.

DGA · 03-02-2010, 10:57 AM

In the past, I've heard that BMW has done the same exact thing on their high-performance car engines. ECU is programmed, during the break in period, to only rev to a certain mark, once the odometer clicks past that point, full engine potential becomes available.

A good source, that has ridden one, tells me the bike is a beast. I want to ride one now.

gilberjj · 03-02-2010, 10:58 AM

Break-in shmeak-in. I would simply tell them, it's MY money, and I want to rev it NOW! That is bull! All bikes need is a good 20 mile break-in. Then change the oil and run them hard. Think about it, every engine is put on a dyno at the factory to ensure that they don't have any defects.

Hawker · 03-02-2010, 11:29 AM

Aprillia did the same thing with the RSV for a long time. Didn't require an ECU reprogram, but the effect was the same. Since that bike liked to drain batteries, most owners got good at the button-dance that reset the rev limiter. I'm sure other manufacturers have done the same, this was just the first that came to mind.

So as far as manufacturers "enforcing" brake in rev limits, there's one example that's over 10 years old. Welcome to the party.

ZXWUT? · 03-02-2010, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by Hawker

Aprillia did the same thing with the RSV for a long time. Didn't require an ECU reprogram, but the effect was the same. Since that bike liked to drain batteries, most owners got good at the button-dance that reset the rev limiter. I'm sure other manufacturers have done the same, this was just the first that came to mind.

So as far as manufacturers "enforcing" brake in rev limits, there's one example that's over 10 years old. Welcome to the party.

I'm sure BMW has had this in the works long before them. I mean, come on, it's BMW. They're super cool and awesome and have F1 technology. They probably even had the F1 technology before F1. My bike uses an internal combustion engine, just like an F1 car but BMW probably came up with that one too. I'm sure of it. A representative told me so; he's my personal representative actually. He tells me things before BMW even knows about it, even though BMW knew about it first.

SpinCycle · 03-02-2010, 11:46 AM

It's an extremely high stress engine without a doubt. I would guess that they have found something in durability testing that they feel the need to take the extra cautious steps. I would also guess that there is no way in hell that they allow this bike to get a rap for failures.

Robusto · 03-02-2010, 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by SpinCycle

It's an extremely high stress engine without a doubt. I would guess that they have found something in durability testing that they feel the need to take the extra cautious steps. I would also guess that there is no way in hell that they allow this bike to get a rap for failures.

Highly likely.

And I would suspect the next 'batch' of engines will be tweeked a bit to address that weakness.

But like mentioned above, this is hardly ground-breaking.

Fat Berries · 03-02-2010, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by Avboden

yeah yeah, I made a thread other than that old one. This deserves it's own topic.

I've just found out that BMW is not releasing new S1000RRs from the dealers until a new fuel mapping has been delivered to the ECU. This will lower the redline to 9000RPM. This will then be removed when the bike hits around 600 miles.

Not quite sure what to make of this...I don't think it's that big of deal but it could point to a few things.

1. BMW is simply wanting to enforce engine break in.
or 2. BMW has already gotten warranty complaints on the engine (I haven't heard of ANY so I don't think this is likely) so they are using this as a precaution.

I've never heard of a manufacturer enforcing breakins like this. What say you? Personally I don't think it's too bad. You can still go like a bat out of hell to 9000RPM, and putting 600 miles on a bike takes 1, maybe 2 days.

discuss, and please keep the hating aside, this is new ground for manufacturers. Will we see others follow suit?

actually thats the first thing i thought. After seeing what people are doing to them after they get their hands on them lately. Maybe not exactly what they anticipated happening to the engines has shown reason to go ahead and impliment that sort of action. Otherwise why didnt they do it up front.

gilberjj · 03-02-2010, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by SpinCycle

It's an extremely high stress engine without a doubt. I would guess that they have found something in durability testing that they feel the need to take the extra cautious steps. I would also guess that there is no way in hell that they allow this bike to get a rap for failures.

Why is everyone acting like BMW is making an engine like nobody else has ever made...... ALL liter bikes have extremely tight tolerances. That's even more reason to just rev them to the moon from the get go. This doesn't add up.

SpinCycle · 03-02-2010, 02:52 PM

I think that they probably already have had issues even though AV hasn't been notified?? How much power does that bike make at 9K? That would suck to have your buddies on 600s give you a run

koorbloh · 03-02-2010, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by SpinCycle

I think that they probably already have had issues even though AV hasn't been notified??

impossible.

theJrod · 03-02-2010, 03:04 PM

Originally Posted by gilberjj

why is everyone acting like bmw is making an engine like nobody else has ever made...... All liter bikes have extremely tight tolerances. That's even more reason to just rev them to the moon from the get go. This doesn't add up.

but whatever - I don't think it's a big conspiracy. BMW (and others) have done this before.


03-02-2010, 10:25 AM	#1
Avboden Moto2 Contender Joined: Oct 2007 From: Pullman/Spokane, Wa I Ride: 2007 BMW F800S, 1999 ATK 605 ESDS/SM, 1978 Honda PA70II (hobbit with kit)	BMW forcing new S1K owners to 9000RPM redline for 600 miles yeah yeah, I made a thread other than that old one. This deserves it's own topic. I've just found out that BMW is not releasing new S1000RRs from the dealers until a new fuel mapping has been delivered to the ECU. This will lower the redline to 9000RPM. This will then be removed when the bike hits around 600 miles. Not quite sure what to make of this...I don't think it's that big of deal but it could point to a few things. 1. BMW is simply wanting to enforce engine break in. or 2. BMW has already gotten warranty complaints on the engine (I haven't heard of ANY so I don't think this is likely) so they are using this as a precaution. I've never heard of a manufacturer enforcing breakins like this. What say you? Personally I don't think it's too bad. You can still go like a bat out of hell to 9000RPM, and putting 600 miles on a bike takes 1, maybe 2 days. discuss, and please keep the hating aside, this is new ground for manufacturers. Will we see others follow suit? __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:28 AM	#2
fastfoodfred Moto2 Champion Joined: Mar 2006 From: spokane, wa I Ride: 2008 SXV4.5 + 2006 ZX6RR + 1985 RZ350 + 2010 YZ250F +	lets them out of warranty costs.....potentially. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:33 AM	#3
Velociraptor Pit Crew Joined: Jun 2006 From: Seattle, WA I Ride: 02 RC51,09 KTM 690r enduro	Well this is the highest performance engine out there for a liter bike and the first year so...... Anyway 9000rpm is pretty fast for the street. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:46 AM	#5
vagrant »-(¯`·.·´¯)-> PNW Joined: Mar 2008 From: Seattle, WA	I guess that stunta dood's bike is in trouble then... Anyhoo, I think its a smart business decision, given that the capability to enforce it is there for a few reasons: (a) prevents the number of returned failed engines they are gonna see = less warranty costs and less bad press, (b) likely reduces the number of noobs/non-noobs that kill themselves on the bike straight after they buy it = less bad press, (vi) haven't thought this one through yet. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:49 AM	#6
Ti954 Railer Joined: Dec 2009 From: S.E. Idaho I Ride: CBR954, YZ400F	IB4A............awwwww crap! __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:49 AM	#7
strangerin Railer Joined: Jul 2005 From: spokane I Ride: other peoples when they let me, working on Honda VF750	Because they can? not like there are not recommendations from other mfd. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:52 AM	#8
KevinD Joined: Mar 2009 From: Spokane Valley I Ride: Suzuki Boulevard C90, Honda CM250C, My Wife's Scooter	Is the firmware update going to be covered under warranty, or will it be done at the owner's expense? KevinD __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:53 AM	#9
theJrod Racer Extraordinaire Joined: Feb 2006 From: Marysville, WA I Ride: Scooty Puff Sr: The Doom-Bringer!	BMW did this with the e46 M3 as well. It wasn't a "forced" redline, but when the car was new the tach would flash yellow and red if rev'ed too high. Even after break-in, the car still did that until it was fully warmed up. Great idea, since warm-up is especially important for high performance engines. The best way to break in an engine is on the dyno. BMW's engine doesn't do anything different than every other engine on the market. An engine is an engine is an engine. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter Last edited by theJrod; 03-02-2010 at 11:05 AM..


03-02-2010, 10:57 AM	#10
DGA Joined: Jun 2007 From: Portland, Oregon I Ride: naked	In the past, I've heard that BMW has done the same exact thing on their high-performance car engines. ECU is programmed, during the break in period, to only rev to a certain mark, once the odometer clicks past that point, full engine potential becomes available. A good source, that has ridden one, tells me the bike is a beast. I want to ride one now. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 10:58 AM	#11
gilberjj Shredder Joined: Feb 2008 From: Olympia, WA I Ride: Zx14	Break-in shmeak-in. I would simply tell them, it's MY money, and I want to rev it NOW! That is bull! All bikes need is a good 20 mile break-in. Then change the oil and run them hard. Think about it, every engine is put on a dyno at the factory to ensure that they don't have any defects. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 11:29 AM	#12
Hawker Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2006 From: Seattle, WA I Ride: Too many	Aprillia did the same thing with the RSV for a long time. Didn't require an ECU reprogram, but the effect was the same. Since that bike liked to drain batteries, most owners got good at the button-dance that reset the rev limiter. I'm sure other manufacturers have done the same, this was just the first that came to mind. So as far as manufacturers "enforcing" brake in rev limits, there's one example that's over 10 years old. Welcome to the party. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 11:46 AM	#14
SpinCycle Peg Dragger Joined: Dec 2007 From: Eugene, OR I Ride: A bunch of Clown bikes..	It's an extremely high stress engine without a doubt. I would guess that they have found something in durability testing that they feel the need to take the extra cautious steps. I would also guess that there is no way in hell that they allow this bike to get a rap for failures. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


03-02-2010, 02:52 PM	#18
SpinCycle Peg Dragger Joined: Dec 2007 From: Eugene, OR I Ride: A bunch of Clown bikes..	I think that they probably already have had issues even though AV hasn't been notified?? How much power does that bike make at 9K? That would suck to have your buddies on 600s give you a run __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

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