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Old 09-02-2012, 07:43 PM   #41
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Joined: Apr 2006
From: HighBridge Snohomish, WA

I Ride: GSXR600,DRZsm
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeames View Post
No, no, all you have to do is stay under the speed limit and nothing can happen to you...
sorry mike, im not trying to be a know it all/douchebag. was just debating. imo at the speed limit (pretty much any normal back road speed limit) a tar snake or succession of them will not make you crash. I have no idea what the proper method for laying them down is. they all look pretty similar to me, i couldnt tell you what a bad one looks like.

“ Quote:
Originally Posted by mattinski View Post
Under ideal circumstances, one skinny little tar snake shouldn't cause much difficulty. But when you have road maintenance morons slop huge amounts of that shit all over the place, then that contributes to bike riding problems. And they can create accidents or at least "oh shit!" moments.

I'd rather have the cracks in the road any day over those slippery bastards. But nobody is asking us.
agreed. there is a difference between a tar snake and a big blob of 'oh fuck!'. cracks are easy to ride on but left unattended those cracks turn into sink holes and stuff.

im not pro/con goverment but understand that a cheap preventative measure is better then tearing out a road every decade. where is the money supposed to come from?

those labor unions dont work fo cheap, you know? better start a new thread on that one

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Old 09-02-2012, 09:29 PM   #42
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Joined: Jan 2011
From: Vancouver, WA

I Ride: '82 Yamaha XJ1100J
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by SiCC View Post
sorry mike, im not trying to be a know it all/douchebag. was just debating. imo at the speed limit (pretty much any normal back road speed limit) a tar snake or succession of them will not make you crash. I have no idea what the proper method for laying them down is. they all look pretty similar to me, i couldnt tell you what a bad one looks like.
No problem, I didn't mean to be so bitchy about it. The whole idea of putting them on the roads just bothers me. They can turn a nice fun road into one that is a lot less relaxing, or imo even dangerous for bike. Just seams pointless to me....there ought to be a better way.

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Old 09-02-2012, 09:37 PM   #43
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Joined: May 2008
From: Lakewood, WA

I Ride: '07 GSXR1000, '06 gixxer 600 track bike, '08 CBR1000RR gone but not forgot...
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by holypiston View Post
I do find that it IS effective in slowing everyone down...so maybe that's the REAL point of that stuff. In that case, cheap and effective, w/ no law enforcement prescence required.
Excuse me, but that is one of the more ridiculous and stupid statements I have heard. Unless you are being ironic...

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Old 09-03-2012, 02:30 AM   #44
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Joined: Oct 2006
From: Vanquiver, WA
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I Ride: RD400F Daytonut
Realistically, that is my negative point of view on this subject.

In our area, the road was perfectly fine and no real pavement irregularities that I or my girlfriend can remember.

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Last edited by holypiston; 09-03-2012 at 02:32 AM.. Reason: i hate tar snakes
 
Old 09-03-2012, 08:20 AM   #45
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Joined: May 2008
From: Lakewood, WA

I Ride: '07 GSXR1000, '06 gixxer 600 track bike, '08 CBR1000RR gone but not forgot...
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by holypiston View Post
Realistically, that is my negative point of view on this subject.

In our area, the road was perfectly fine and no real pavement irregularities that I or my girlfriend can remember.
#1 this thread is not about perfectly fine roads
#2 you still have a sublimely idiotic argument that tar snakes are a good idea. That is perverse-- and stupid. Next thing you'll be saying drunk drivers are a good thing for population control.

If you think tar snakes are a good idea, you are a minority of one.

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Old 09-03-2012, 08:34 AM   #46
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Joined: May 2009
From: Wilsonville, OR

I Ride: '92 Suzuki VX800, '88 pre-Ninja EX500, RIP-'74 'Kwacker' 400 S3
On a follow-on of tar snakes, . . .
how about 'round-a-bound' center lane paint?

Noticed that the painted center line just happens
to be the same material that they use at the
intersections for the stop line before the crosswalk.

Thick, wide, glass-bead, raised, and highly reflective.
Some are the embedded pattern that retains the
reflectiveness, but it makes them like ICE !!!

Does the AMA have any plans on tackling that ???

Suggestion for the tar snakes. While the tar is hot,
put some sandy-gravel, or gravely-sand on the strip.
I know, more money, time, effort, . . . but safer ???

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Old 09-03-2012, 08:42 AM   #47
mjn
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Joined: Jul 2005
From: Tri-Cities
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I Ride: '05 Busa, '81 Seca 550, '78 Hawk, '69 Z50A
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by SiCC View Post
false. when i lead i always go 1 under the limit. you can blame Mark for setting such a blistering pace
Oh sure... blame me!

I seem to remember a couple times when you led that we might have broken a few speed limits..

Tar snakes can definitely be unnerving, but first and foremost, you need to SEE them... when you do, the simple answer is to back it off a notch and move your line inside a bit more, giving you more room to slide to the outside. The bike only slides an inch or so on each chunk of tar....

I don't mind 'em... it just adds another degree of difficulty to the ride.

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Old 09-03-2012, 09:59 AM   #48
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Joined: Oct 2006
From: Vanquiver, WA
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I Ride: RD400F Daytonut
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by mattinski View Post
#1 this thread is not about perfectly fine roads
#2 you still have a sublimely idiotic argument that tar snakes are a good idea. That is perverse-- and stupid. Next thing you'll be saying drunk drivers are a good thing for population control.

If you think tar snakes are a good idea, you are a minority of one.
WRONG. When did I say tar snakes are a good idea? I said from THEIR (WDOT) point of view. #2. I STARTED a thread in the vancouver section (before i even posted on this one)WARNING fellow riders of how dangerous these are and one of the guys i rode w/ on a supermoto just about bit it on one of them.

WARNING!!: Amboy / Chelatchie Prairie ROADWORK

I was saying how effective this dangerous technique is on slowing riders down. I didn't say i was happy w/ it. There lies the irony. I am NOT happy one bit w/ tar snakes. So yes, if you read it this way...ironic. I'm trying to get inside their heads.

I'm trying to give one valid reason why...and that is on topic. why tar snake a perfectly good road? to slow riders down...

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Last edited by holypiston; 09-03-2012 at 10:36 AM.. Reason: Sarcasm is just one more free service I offer
 
Old 09-03-2012, 10:54 AM   #49
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Joined: Jan 2011
From: Vancouver, WA

I Ride: '82 Yamaha XJ1100J
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by mjn View Post

Tar snakes can definitely be unnerving, but first and foremost, you need to SEE them... when you do, the simple answer is to back it off a notch and move your line inside a bit more, giving you more room to slide to the outside.
I agree to a point, if the tar snakes are properly applied and of a reasonable width...and a fair amount of them are that way. But there's a lot that aren't...their too wide or too close together and can be more than a nuisance.

Yes you definitely need to be able to see them just like gravel or any other road hazard...and pick your line, but in some cases there is now good line and you have a problem.

I have to ask, do you prefer to putt through the corners wiggling your way through road hazards like gravel and tar snakes...or would you much rather prefer a relatively clean road surface?

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Old 09-03-2012, 11:15 AM   #50
mjn
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From: Tri-Cities
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I Ride: '05 Busa, '81 Seca 550, '78 Hawk, '69 Z50A
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeames View Post
I have to ask, do you prefer to putt through the corners wiggling your way through road hazards like gravel and tar snakes...or would you much rather prefer a relatively clean road surface?
LOL! Honestly, I like a challenge.

I've ridden the backroads of NE Oregon for years, and have come to expect the unexpected.

I like Grant 20.. cattle guards mid corner, cow shit all over the place..
Love Dooley.. gravel on the inside of damn near every corner on the south side.. just gotta pick the right line..
FS52 south of Ukiah.. where Mattinski had his get-off.. LOTS of new tar snakes.. again, it's a matter of backing off a touch and picking a line around (hopefully) the worst of 'em
OR203, Rd to Medical Springs, north of Baker..woke my ass right up when I hit the first bunch of tar snakes on a 90mph left hand sweeper..skip-hook-skip-hook etc.. I slowed down a bit and used the whole lane on the following corners.

Yes... in a perfect world, I'd love to have no tar snakes, no gravel, no oncoming ranchers in the wrong lane, no cows or cow shit.. no cattle guards, no trees right next to the road.. but then, I'd be at the track.

In general States, Counties, and the Forest Service are doing the best with what they have.. I'd rather have some tar snakes instead of chunks of asphalt coming up..

The bottom line is we all need to realize that backroads are never perfect, and embrace it.. If you rip backroads, you'd damn well better have 100% focus 100% of the time, or they'll bite you. As we've seen in the last few weeks, it might be the last "bite" you'll experience..

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Old 09-03-2012, 11:45 AM   #51
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Joined: Jan 2009
From: Vancouver, WA

I Ride: '05 600RR
Motorcycles have only been around 100+ years. It's not like they should have any reason to be competent enough to build/repair roads so that they won't try to kill us.

It's not like they're incompetent or discriminate when it comes to motorcycles. Right?




It's total BS we that we still have so many problems with traffic signals too.

It's not like we expect anything to be perfect, but they continuously put very little effort into making things safe. We're still lucky if they even throw up a warning sign. And obviously in more rural areas, much less should be expected.

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Last edited by anti; 09-03-2012 at 11:52 AM..
 
Old 09-03-2012, 12:07 PM   #52
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Joined: May 2011
From: LaCenter, WA

I Ride: 2003 Copper SV1K
I dunno what the issue is. I have never had an issue with tar snakes. Sure, your front wheel might slip an inch or two but nothing serious. I live out in the sticks and see these things all the time. Shoot, I even rail them with no ill effects. Besides, it's always someone else's fault, right? Isn't that what we're all about now??

If you people are that serious about this shiz, you need to be emailing your senators and congress folks and city council members and making a stink about it rather than complaining on some internet forum that none of them will ever read. TexasL seems to make a difference because he actually DOES something about it rather than just complaining. They are your tax dollars they are spending. If you have an issue with how it's being spent, then speak up. It's your right. Sheesh.

As far as traffic signals go, a simple email to the city usually results in someone giving a crap about it and getting it readjusted.

Discriminating against motorcycles? Sure, when you're the minority everything is discrimination that's not made specifically for you. Some of the crap in this thread makes me sick.

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Old 09-03-2012, 12:30 PM   #53
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Joined: Oct 2006
From: Vanquiver, WA
Blog Entries: 2

I Ride: RD400F Daytonut
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by RedKat600 View Post
If you have an issue with how it's being spent, then speak up. It's your right. Sheesh.

Sure, when you're the minority everything is discrimination that's not made specifically for you. Some of the crap in this thread makes me sick.
To be honest. I would like something made specifically for me..but then eats like dis..---->

Obama 4 more years....oorah!!

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Last edited by holypiston; 09-03-2012 at 12:35 PM.. Reason: too many cooks
 
Old 09-09-2012, 09:08 PM   #54
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Joined: Mar 2012
From: Shoreline, WA

I Ride: F800GS
I don't have an issue with a "tar snake," but when it becomes a "bunch of snakes" that's when I have a problem. I'm currently battling the City of Shoreline regarding a "bunch of snakes on a particular roadway corner that causes me problems on warm days and on wet/rainy days.

But before you go on your tyrades about why the state and other local agencies are out to slow motorcyclists... Listen, "tar snakes" are a colloquial term for crack sealing. The goal of the crack seal is that as the road heats up, the tar gets into the crack preventing water from seeping into the crack which could cause potholes or erosion to the roadway subgrade. Yes, you could put an aggregate into the crackseal, but overtime, that aggregate will wear itself out of the tar and you will have the same tar snake as before. In other cases, the aggregate may not permit the tar to bond appropriately to the roadway or crack and may result in further degradation of the roadway.

Now there are other ways to extend pavement life without completely repaving the roadway. These include chip-seals: where tar and crushed rock are spread onto the roadway. Those have their own challenges to motorcycles. Thankfully, WSDOT requires contractors to sweep after the spreading of rocks before the last tarring of the roadway (depending on the contract).

My issue with repaved roads is that I usually wait until a few good rains until I go riding on it. My first biff on a motorcycle was on a fresh mat of asphalt, which was all sudsy with a fresh rain. I tried to slow down as I approached a roundabout, and I ended up laying the bike down. It's all good though.

...and if you only vent your frustrations about how motorcycles are being neglected on Washington State roadways on this forum, you're not getting your point across to the vital decision making people. You need to talk to your legislators and your local DOT offices.

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Old 09-09-2012, 10:00 PM   #55
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Joined: Jun 2008
From: Snohomish, WA

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Theres another side to this that I haven't seen brought up yet.

The contact patch on a motorcycle is probably pretty close to the same width as tar snakes, but the contact patch on a car tire is anywhere from 4 to 8 times bigger (depending on the tire/vehicle). DOT designs roads for cars not motorcycles. So that could be there reasoning for not worrying about the overspill when applying tar snakes.

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Old 09-09-2012, 10:20 PM   #56
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Joined: Apr 2012
From: Port Angeles

I Ride: 2010 R1 Vale' Edition, '86 GTR1000
actually if you have riden in the port angeles area recently. you can bear witness to the aplication of wonderful little shovelfulls of chipseal gravel on tarsnakes. its the most wonderful thing cruising along(clipping actually)and seeing little piles and strips of what apears to be loose gravel(illegal gravel)randomly scattered on your favorite bike paths... little sqirm from a snake is better than target fixation on what appears very much like illegal gravel........

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Old 09-09-2012, 10:32 PM   #57
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Joined: Jul 2007
From: An unstated X,Y,Z coordinate

I Ride: 09 Blk Daytona 675 (better than hoochie), BLK/Silver 06 Tiger, Red 04 R1, Yellow 99 Daytona 955i
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by mattinski View Post
ooohhhh! that was the problem! next time I won't try to keep up with you.....at least on sketchy roads...
Get sticky tires instead of the hard rock mining tires

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Old 09-09-2012, 10:48 PM   #58
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From: Vancouver, WA

I Ride: '82 Yamaha XJ1100J
“ Quote:
Originally Posted by RedKat600 View Post
If you people are that serious about this shiz, you need to be emailing your senators and congress folks and city council members and making a stink about it rather than complaining on some internet forum that none of them will ever read. TexasL seems to make a difference because he actually DOES something about it rather than just complaining. They are your tax dollars they are spending. If you have an issue with how it's being spent, then speak up. It's your right. Sheesh.
Did you read the whole thread from up there on your horse?

That's exactly what I started this thread asking about. Has anyone been working on this? Clubs, groups, etc? It makes much more sense to join and effort in progress that to create a new one from scratch...and government types listen to numbers, rarely individuals...because majorities elect people (except presidents...)

It's frustrating how many people assume that anyone who posts anything on these forums must be a complete moron that started riding yesterday. I mean it's pretty obvious to most people who have some miles under their belts that skinny little 2" tar snakes are of little issue...but when you're looking at 6" wide snakes splattered all over the road in a corner in a way that makes it nearly impossible to ride through them they become more of a hazard and less of a nuisance.
Of course the tar snakes are probably the most economic way to make the pavement last a little longer...but that doesn't mean that they shouldn't be applied properly does it?

I guess after this big long thread all I have learned is no...no one is working on this or at least no one in this group knows about it.
Thanks, that's all I needed to know.

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