PNW Riders

raceface · 10-08-2009, 10:44 PM

My limited understanding tells me a high side is a loss of traction resulting in a slide followed by a violent return of traction.

That's all well and good, but what can be the causes of that initial loss of traction? CG? Power? Braking? What can I do to prevent it.

Same for low sides and front tucks. What causes them and how to prevent them?

Many thanks oh great ones.

odin544 · 10-08-2009, 10:53 PM

You're full of questions tonight huh? LOL

I'll let someone with more experience answer this.

raceface · 10-08-2009, 10:56 PM

Yep. Figured winter is a good time to brush up on the knowledge. Starting now. Thanks for your input on that other thread. It seems the more I find out about this stuff the more of a dark art it is.

mcjunky · 10-08-2009, 11:02 PM

pissed off chassis

raceface · 10-08-2009, 11:05 PM

K, that's a start.

MikeM · 10-08-2009, 11:05 PM

It's to late.... I'll tell you in the morning :-)

raceface · 10-08-2009, 11:12 PM

Fast Eddie 919 · 10-09-2009, 02:27 AM

Cold tires.

Transported · 10-09-2009, 07:20 AM

Highsides: 1) rear braking causing a skid, then letting off the pedal; 2) acceleration causing slide, then chopping the throttle off.

MikeM · 10-09-2009, 07:43 AM

There are a ton of different reasons you might encounter one of these problems and a bunch of different variables but here are the main reasons providing you are on decent tires, your suspension and chasis is set up correctly and you are being smooth with your input.

Lowside: The cause is that you are asking too much from the front tire. You can do this by trail braking too deep or more commonly is that you actually rolled out of the throttle when you should have stayed neutral throttle or slightly positive. I would say 90% of lowsides you'll see at a trackday could have been saved had they been on the gas rather than closed throttle or brake. That's why you'll see the fast people back on the gas as soon as they are done braking. It transfers some of the weight back to the rear tire so that you can use more front tire traction to complete your turn.

Highside: There are a couple ways you can highside, either on the gas or the on the brakes.

If you highside on the brakes its normaly from grabbing a downshift dumping the clutch and the back starts to slide. You should be slowly letting the clutch out and feeling for available traction when down shifting. Slipper clutches are your friend!

The typical highside if from too much throttle coming out of a corner. You need to be very smooth when rolling on the throttle coming out of a corner while you are feeling for traction. (this is harder if you have both cheecks hanging off hell bent to drag your knee :-)
If the rear tire start to slide you should not chop the throttle but maintain it, weight the outside peg a little while working on standing the bike up untill you are back in line and then continue to apply throttle. When you chop the throttle is when you run into problems.

Again, there are a ton of variables that can contribute to either one of these, but these are big contributing factors.

D_Rail · 10-09-2009, 08:51 AM

Originally Posted by Fast Eddie 919

Cold tires.

Such a common thing to blame things on. But no!

theJrod · 10-09-2009, 09:28 AM

Lowsides = catastrophic loss of traction (I say catastrophic because a loss of traction alone != a crash. You can save a front end or rear end slide a lot easier than people think).
Highside = major loss of traction (of the rear, usually) followed by a sudden regaining of traction. Weeeeee.

Edit: I almost forgot - any highside or lowside is 100% because of poor tire choice. Yeah. Or it's another rider's fault.

Hypnotiq · 10-09-2009, 09:39 AM

Originally Posted by theJrod

Edit: I almost forgot - any highside or lowside is 100% because of poor tire choice. Yeah. Or it's another rider's fault.

. Don't forget cold tires or overriding the equipment.

BoBo · 10-09-2009, 09:51 AM

Simple answer....

Lowside - caused by loss of traction while cornering

Highside - caused by loss of traction and then restored traction under heavy acceleration. Violent fish-tailing

mjn · 10-09-2009, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by MikeM

There are a ton of different reasons you might encounter one of these problems and a bunch of different variables but here are the main reasons providing you are on decent tires, your suspension and chasis is set up correctly and you are being smooth with your input.

Lowside: The cause is that you are asking too much from the front tire. You can do this by trail braking too deep or more commonly is that you actually rolled out of the throttle when you should have stayed neutral throttle or slightly positive. I would say 90% of lowsides you'll see at a trackday could have been saved had they been on the gas rather than closed throttle or brake. That's why you'll see the fast people back on the gas as soon as they are done braking. It transfers some of the weight back to the rear tire so that you can use more front tire traction to complete your turn.

.

Great info.. but a lowside can also be the result of asking too much from your rear tire as well..

Sept of last year at SRP, T7... wrong line (outside-off camber) and too much throttle on good, warm tires.. she went down so stinkin fast it was amazing.. one second I was goin thru the corner..next I was sliding down the asphalt..
PURE rider error.

firecracker · 10-09-2009, 10:03 AM

This past summer I learned a ton at the Sullivan Race School. One of the things I learned was to ride at very, very, very high rpms to avoid highside falls. If your rear begins to spin and you're at 11,500 or something close, you can roll on the throttle slowly without giving the rear too much power. If you're riding at medium or low rpms, you're more likely to highside when your rear begins to spin and you roll on the throttle...the rear catches with a lot of power at low or medium rpms, tossing you up and over. I think this saved me on cold tires in turn 1 at PIR later on in the year!

Fast Eddie 919 · 10-09-2009, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by D_Rail

Such a common thing to blame things on. But no!

I'm a little perplexed by this response. I see you are a more experienced rider than I am so I would be interested to hear you elaborate. I thought it was a factor in a highside I had a few years back, I have had several friends 3 other guys, and myself, and many others who have related to the same or similar experience. You pull out of the drive way crack the throttle and the bike swaps ends on you, these were all late model bikes with good tires on them.

theJrod · 10-09-2009, 11:07 AM

Cold tires do offer less grip - that is true.

However, the blame lies on the rider for asking too much of a cold tire. Modern tires have so much grip when warm, that they mask/hide a lot of errors riders are making. You can get away with being jerky on the throttle because the tires are so sticky. If you're smooth on the inputs, cold tires really aren't that bad. This is why riding in the rain is such a great learning experience. Any sudden inputs or jerkiness is instantly known!

the chemist · 10-09-2009, 11:44 AM

most of the time you go down, its your fault. there is the occasional time were shit just happens and theres nothing you can do. oil spills, starts raining mid session while you're on DOTS and a corner is super wet, someone kicks gravel all over a corner...

if you're smooth you can feel the traction go away on the rear. if you get on the throttle smoothly and the rear starts spinning, you can bring it back, because it wont have stepped out too far. if you just whack the throttle, its going to slide out all the way and flick you to high heaven before you know what happened.

another cause of crashing is releasing the clutch too fast on a start.

MikeM · 10-09-2009, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by the chemist

another cause of crashing is releasing the clutch too fast on a start.

I don't think there are going to be that many people pulling that particular crash off....

MikeM · 10-09-2009, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by firecracker

This past summer I learned a ton at the Sullivan Race School. One of the things I learned was to ride at very, very, very high rpms to avoid highside falls. If your rear begins to spin and you're at 11,500 or something close, you can roll on the throttle slowly without giving the rear too much power. If you're riding at medium or low rpms, you're more likely to highside when your rear begins to spin and you roll on the throttle...the rear catches with a lot of power at low or medium rpms, tossing you up and over. I think this saved me on cold tires in turn 1 at PIR later on in the year!

What I've always found interesting about this concept is most bikes make more power the higher up in the rpm range you are. So this doesn't really make sense to me.

I know that on my bike there are a couple of corners I take in second rather than 1st just so its easier to manage traction and wheel spin.

chaeric · 10-09-2009, 02:17 PM

I was at ORP following Paytheon for a number of laps. Everything was fine, but at a corner that led to a fast straightaway when I used too much gas the rear started stepping out quite a bit. For some reason I thought to decrease the throttle by 30% or so

...and like as everybody has mentioned above the rear suddenly caught traction and I nearly highsided, and did a mini-tank slapper.

Which reminds me. I relaxed my arms, and the tank slapper went away, but then I learned that my brakes for some reason didn't work so I had to pump them a few times. So if you get a tank slapper remember to pump your brakes after you regain control.

Paytheon · 10-09-2009, 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by chaeric

I was at ORP following Paytheon for a number of laps. Everything was fine, but at a corner that led to a fast straightaway when I used too much gas the rear started stepping out quite a bit. For some reason I thought to decrease the throttle by 30% or so

...and like as everybody has mentioned above the rear suddenly caught traction and I nearly highsided, and did a mini-tank slapper.

Which reminds me. I relaxed my arms, and the tank slapper went away, but then I learned that my brakes for some reason didn't work so I had to pump them a few times. So if you get a tank slapper remember to pump your brakes after you regain control.

Man, I'm glad you got her under control.

firecracker · 10-09-2009, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by MikeM

What I've always found interesting about this concept is most bikes make more power the higher up in the rpm range you are. So this doesn't really make sense to me.

I know that on my bike there are a couple of corners I take in second rather than 1st just so its easier to manage traction and wheel spin.

The amount of torque on a GSX-R1000 does seem to begin to decrease quite drastically around 10,000 to 11,000 rpms, and especially around 12,000 to 13,000 rpms, but I know what you mean...it's great in concept, but maybe not in practice. The high, high revs. seem to upset the bike quite a bit, especially if the bike is in 1st. EmDee takes T4 in 1st, which seems pretty nuts to me...and that's on a 600 that's pretty "jumpy" in 1st!!!

MikeM · 10-09-2009, 03:10 PM

Originally Posted by firecracker

The amount of torque on a GSX-R1000 does seem to begin to decrease quite drastically around 10,000 to 11,000 rpms, and especially around 12,000 to 13,000 rpms, but I know what you mean...it's great in concept, but maybe not in practice. The high, high revs. seem to upset the bike quite a bit, especially if the bike is in 1st. EmDee takes T4 in 1st, which seems pretty nuts to me...and that's on a 600 that's pretty "jumpy" in 1st!!!

You have to take that corner in 1st on a 600 otherwise you have to get off and push for a while until the thing spools up enough to make any power.

The reason people go into a corner with the revs high is so that they get a good drive coming out....

NoQuarter#121 · 10-09-2009, 03:55 PM

I take T4 in first... its T5 I've been having problems with lately....

stevieb · 10-09-2009, 04:36 PM

T4 in first??....no wonder I'm so damn slow

Someone remind me about this come March 2010 cause I'll forget and spend all next season pussy-footin around it in 2nd

raceface · 10-09-2009, 06:27 PM

I just found this while sifting around online. Seems pretty informative.

http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/to...?TOPIC_ID=2192

nocontrol74 · 10-09-2009, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by MikeM

If the rear tire start to slide you should not chop the throttle but maintain it, weight the outside peg a little while working on standing the bike up untill you are back in line and then continue to apply throttle. When you chop the throttle is when you run into problems.

I can attest that this is the truth. Don't do it. It hurts and it's expensive.

Especially don't do it twice. On consecutive corners. On consecutive track days....

Wrench · 10-09-2009, 06:46 PM

Originally Posted by raceface

My limited understanding tells me a high side is a loss of traction resulting in a slide followed by a violent return of traction.

That's all well and good, but what can be the causes of that initial loss of traction? CG? Power? Braking? What can I do to prevent it.

Same for low sides and front tucks. What causes them and how to prevent them?

Many thanks oh great ones.

Sand or gravel on the road.

It's the only reason anyone ever looses traction and has an accident...

odin544 · 10-09-2009, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by Wrench

Sand or gravel on the road.

It's the only reason anyone ever looses traction and has an accident...

LIES its those damn tar snakes! they jump out at ya!

ducatichick · 10-09-2009, 07:22 PM

If you drag anything unforgiving, like an exhaust or fixed footpeg, you can lose traction. One time in a race back in '99 some guy hit my exhaust and bent it down - I didn't know (heard about it later), took the next left hander, dragged the exhaust, then highsided. All I remember was flying through the air, waking up face down in the dirt, then staggering around looking for my bike. Took me a few minutes to find my bike and it was pretty messed up. Talked my way out of an ambulance ride. I recommend against highsiding.

So basically, it's the other rider's fault!

Have you read the Keith Code books? Titles are A Twist of the Wrist 1, 2, and Soft Science of Motorcycle Racing. They might be helpful since he explains some of the things that can cause lowsides etc.

Deerhunter · 10-09-2009, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by MikeM

If the rear tire start to slide you should not chop

EASIER SAID THAN DONE, EH?

bigtbone · 10-09-2009, 08:23 PM

I've lowsided many times and high sided a few. The highsides are infinitely more painful physically and do more damage to the bike.

EZ Definition: Low side means you hit the ground first. Highside you are still in the air while your bike is on the ground.....it very surreal watching stuff 10' beneath you while you wait for the pile driver to hit.

WTFO · 10-09-2009, 10:21 PM

Originally Posted by chaeric

I was at ORP following Paytheon for a number of laps. Everything was fine, but at a corner that led to a fast straightaway when I used too much gas the rear started stepping out quite a bit. For some reason I thought to decrease the throttle by 30% or so

...and like as everybody has mentioned above the rear suddenly caught traction and I nearly highsided, and did a mini-tank slapper.

Which reminds me. I relaxed my arms, and the tank slapper went away, but then I learned that my brakes for some reason didn't work so I had to pump them a few times. So if you get a tank slapper remember to pump your brakes after you regain control.

If I remember some comments by Keith Code in one of his books he stated to the effect that most folks cause a tank slapper to result in a wreck because they fight it versus letting the chasiss actually sort it out by in essence "letting go of the clip ons" so to speak.

Deerhunter · 10-10-2009, 05:02 AM

"Fighting it" transfers the energy of a headshake to the chassis through your body. Bad. Loosening your hands lets it dissipate up front which, they say, is a good thing.

Hypnotiq · 10-10-2009, 07:43 AM

Originally Posted by stevieb

T4 in first??....no wonder I'm so damn slow

Someone remind me about this come March 2010 cause I'll forget and spend all next season pussy-footin around it in 2nd

Really Stevie? You didnt know this? I'm sorry... :(

chaeric · 10-10-2009, 11:36 AM

Originally Posted by WTFO

If I remember some comments by Keith Code in one of his books he stated to the effect that most folks cause a tank slapper to result in a wreck because they fight it versus letting the chasiss actually sort it out by in essence "letting go of the clip ons" so to speak.

Well I actually grabbed the handlebars so I wouldn't be flung off the bike...if I didn't do it I probably wouldve fallen off. It did however start a tank slapper. However, I did exactly what you and Deerhunter said and the situation resolved itself.

the chemist · 10-10-2009, 02:45 PM

Originally Posted by Deerhunter

EASIER SAID THAN DONE, EH?

After you chop it and have a huge high side, you learn the lesson. Although it is hard to stay on the gas when the back just keeps coming around...you actually have more of a chance of saving it if you stay on the gas. there have been a couple times now were i had to consciously tell myself to stay on the gas (and I saved them somehow). if you chop it you're a goner. after you do it once and get transported, you learn

Originally Posted by bigtbone

EZ Definition: Low side means you hit the ground first. Highside you are still in the air while your bike is on the ground.....it very surreal watching stuff 10' beneath you while you wait for the pile driver to hit.

To be added to Tyson's statement:
Lowsides tend to happen fast. Its "you're going through a corner, feel the front go, and youre in the air fence". High sides on the other hand...are more like "I felt the rear slide, about 30 minutes later it hooked and tossed me. I watched the bike go flipping, found a cure for cancer, solved world hunger, and made a sandwich. then i got hit by a train, which was followed by a bus."

raceface · 10-12-2009, 11:56 AM

Thanks for all the information guys. I know I haven't said much but I really appreciate the input. This is going to help.


10-08-2009, 10:53 PM	#2
odin544 Superbiker Joined: Apr 2007 From: Kennewick, Washington I Ride: '08 Ducati 848 street , '03 R6 race (for sale), '07 R6 race	You're full of questions tonight huh? LOL I'll let someone with more experience answer this. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-08-2009, 10:56 PM	#3
raceface Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2009 From: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho I Ride: 2006 R6	Yep. Figured winter is a good time to brush up on the knowledge. Starting now. Thanks for your input on that other thread. It seems the more I find out about this stuff the more of a dark art it is. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-08-2009, 11:02 PM	#4
mcjunky Superbiker Joined: Jun 2005 From: spokane I Ride: rz's, rd's, kx's, nsr's, rx, yz with a little zx thrown in	pissed off chassis __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-08-2009, 11:05 PM	#5
raceface Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2009 From: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho I Ride: 2006 R6	K, that's a start. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-08-2009, 11:05 PM	#6
MikeM WMRRA Qualifier Joined: Jul 2007 From: Covington, WA	It's to late.... I'll tell you in the morning :-) __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

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10-08-2009, 10:44 PM	#1
raceface Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2009 From: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho I Ride: 2006 R6	What Causes A Low/High Side? My limited understanding tells me a high side is a loss of traction resulting in a slide followed by a violent return of traction. That's all well and good, but what can be the causes of that initial loss of traction? CG? Power? Braking? What can I do to prevent it. Same for low sides and front tucks. What causes them and how to prevent them? Many thanks oh great ones. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-08-2009, 11:12 PM	#7
raceface Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2009 From: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho I Ride: 2006 R6	Yay! __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 02:27 AM	#8
Fast Eddie 919 Superbiker Joined: Jan 2009 From: Vancouver, WA I Ride: 04 Kawi ZZR 1200	Cold tires. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 07:20 AM	#9
Transported MotoGP Champion Joined: Dec 2006 From: Portland, Oregon Blog Entries: 1 I Ride: '99 R1, '80 Suz GS450S	Highsides: 1) rear braking causing a skid, then letting off the pedal; 2) acceleration causing slide, then chopping the throttle off. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 07:43 AM	#10
MikeM WMRRA Qualifier Joined: Jul 2007 From: Covington, WA	There are a ton of different reasons you might encounter one of these problems and a bunch of different variables but here are the main reasons providing you are on decent tires, your suspension and chasis is set up correctly and you are being smooth with your input. Lowside: The cause is that you are asking too much from the front tire. You can do this by trail braking too deep or more commonly is that you actually rolled out of the throttle when you should have stayed neutral throttle or slightly positive. I would say 90% of lowsides you'll see at a trackday could have been saved had they been on the gas rather than closed throttle or brake. That's why you'll see the fast people back on the gas as soon as they are done braking. It transfers some of the weight back to the rear tire so that you can use more front tire traction to complete your turn. Highside: There are a couple ways you can highside, either on the gas or the on the brakes. If you highside on the brakes its normaly from grabbing a downshift dumping the clutch and the back starts to slide. You should be slowly letting the clutch out and feeling for available traction when down shifting. Slipper clutches are your friend! The typical highside if from too much throttle coming out of a corner. You need to be very smooth when rolling on the throttle coming out of a corner while you are feeling for traction. (this is harder if you have both cheecks hanging off hell bent to drag your knee :-) If the rear tire start to slide you should not chop the throttle but maintain it, weight the outside peg a little while working on standing the bike up untill you are back in line and then continue to apply throttle. When you chop the throttle is when you run into problems. Again, there are a ton of variables that can contribute to either one of these, but these are big contributing factors. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 09:28 AM	#12
theJrod Moderator Joined: Feb 2006 From: Marysville, WA I Ride: Scooty Puff Sr: The Doom-Bringer!	Lowsides = catastrophic loss of traction (I say catastrophic because a loss of traction alone != a crash. You can save a front end or rear end slide a lot easier than people think). Highside = major loss of traction (of the rear, usually) followed by a sudden regaining of traction. Weeeeee. Edit: I almost forgot - any highside or lowside is 100% because of poor tire choice. Yeah. Or it's another rider's fault. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 09:51 AM	#14
BoBo Pit Crew Joined: Jan 2008 From: Everett, WA I Ride: Aprilia RSVR Mille	Simple answer.... Lowside - caused by loss of traction while cornering Highside - caused by loss of traction and then restored traction under heavy acceleration. Violent fish-tailing __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 10:03 AM	#16
firecracker Training Wheels Joined: Aug 2009 From: Seattle, WA I Ride: GSXR 1000 K9 and GSXR 1000 K9	This past summer I learned a ton at the Sullivan Race School. One of the things I learned was to ride at very, very, very high rpms to avoid highside falls. If your rear begins to spin and you're at 11,500 or something close, you can roll on the throttle slowly without giving the rear too much power. If you're riding at medium or low rpms, you're more likely to highside when your rear begins to spin and you roll on the throttle...the rear catches with a lot of power at low or medium rpms, tossing you up and over. I think this saved me on cold tires in turn 1 at PIR later on in the year! __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 11:07 AM	#18
theJrod Moderator Joined: Feb 2006 From: Marysville, WA I Ride: Scooty Puff Sr: The Doom-Bringer!	Cold tires do offer less grip - that is true. However, the blame lies on the rider for asking too much of a cold tire. Modern tires have so much grip when warm, that they mask/hide a lot of errors riders are making. You can get away with being jerky on the throttle because the tires are so sticky. If you're smooth on the inputs, cold tires really aren't that bad. This is why riding in the rain is such a great learning experience. Any sudden inputs or jerkiness is instantly known! __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 11:44 AM	#19
the chemist ducatiduane Joined: Feb 2007 From: Cheney I Ride: but not on the street.	most of the time you go down, its your fault. there is the occasional time were shit just happens and theres nothing you can do. oil spills, starts raining mid session while you're on DOTS and a corner is super wet, someone kicks gravel all over a corner... if you're smooth you can feel the traction go away on the rear. if you get on the throttle smoothly and the rear starts spinning, you can bring it back, because it wont have stepped out too far. if you just whack the throttle, its going to slide out all the way and flick you to high heaven before you know what happened. another cause of crashing is releasing the clutch too fast on a start. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 02:17 PM	#22
chaeric Training Wheels Joined: Jul 2009 From: Kirkland, WA I Ride: while I'm young	I was at ORP following Paytheon for a number of laps. Everything was fine, but at a corner that led to a fast straightaway when I used too much gas the rear started stepping out quite a bit. For some reason I thought to decrease the throttle by 30% or so ...and like as everybody has mentioned above the rear suddenly caught traction and I nearly highsided, and did a mini-tank slapper. Which reminds me. I relaxed my arms, and the tank slapper went away, but then I learned that my brakes for some reason didn't work so I had to pump them a few times. So if you get a tank slapper remember to pump your brakes after you regain control. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 03:55 PM	#26
NoQuarter#121 Zone Head Joined: Sep 2007 From: 2nd star to the right and straight on 'til morning I Ride: on ice at 15F below zero	I take T4 in first... its T5 I've been having problems with lately.... __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 04:36 PM	#27
stevieb Pit Crew Joined: Feb 2007 From: Seattle, WA	T4 in first??....no wonder I'm so damn slow Someone remind me about this come March 2010 cause I'll forget and spend all next season pussy-footin around it in 2nd __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 06:27 PM	#28
raceface Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2009 From: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho I Ride: 2006 R6	I just found this while sifting around online. Seems pretty informative. http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/to...?TOPIC_ID=2192 __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 07:22 PM	#32
ducatichick WMRRA Qualifier Joined: Jul 2009 From: Corvallis, OR I Ride: 08 Hypervibrator	If you drag anything unforgiving, like an exhaust or fixed footpeg, you can lose traction. One time in a race back in '99 some guy hit my exhaust and bent it down - I didn't know (heard about it later), took the next left hander, dragged the exhaust, then highsided. All I remember was flying through the air, waking up face down in the dirt, then staggering around looking for my bike. Took me a few minutes to find my bike and it was pretty messed up. Talked my way out of an ambulance ride. I recommend against highsiding. So basically, it's the other rider's fault! Have you read the Keith Code books? Titles are A Twist of the Wrist 1, 2, and Soft Science of Motorcycle Racing. They might be helpful since he explains some of the things that can cause lowsides etc. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-09-2009, 08:23 PM	#34
bigtbone Training Wheels Joined: Nov 2007 From: Lake Oswego, OR I Ride: Ducati 1098, Honda CRF450r	I've lowsided many times and high sided a few. The highsides are infinitely more painful physically and do more damage to the bike. EZ Definition: Low side means you hit the ground first. Highside you are still in the air while your bike is on the ground.....it very surreal watching stuff 10' beneath you while you wait for the pile driver to hit. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter


10-10-2009, 05:02 AM	#36
Deerhunter Endorsed Joined: Oct 2007 From: Portland, OR I Ride: Motorbikes	"Fighting it" transfers the energy of a headshake to the chassis through your body. Bad. Loosening your hands lets it dissipate up front which, they say, is a good thing. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter Last edited by Deerhunter; 10-10-2009 at 09:36 AM.. Reason: Punctuation error


10-12-2009, 11:56 AM	#40
raceface Pit Crew Joined: Apr 2009 From: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho I Ride: 2006 R6	Thanks for all the information guys. I know I haven't said much but I really appreciate the input. This is going to help. __________________ Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

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