RideSlow2004

[QUOTE=ebesel;2866520]
I have first hand knowledge of the training and the Motor Officers. I can say with absolute certainty, that you do not have a clue what you are talking about. SPD Motor Officers are all highly trained and skilled riders. Some more skilled than others, but all very good riders.

QUOTE]

What he said.

If you can pass a basic motor officer course, and the yearly re-certs, you can ride. LE operation is a whole different world than any other kind of riding. If you haven't done it, you don't really know it. And if you don't know it, go entertain yerself some other way.

LE riding doesn't require the fastest or best handling bike, it requires predictable and reliable. You are married to that motor, for better or worse, for 8, 10, 12, or more hrs a day.

Anyone that continues to maintain that running a cone course involves laying the bike down on the crash bars, isn't really close enough to what is happening, to comment.

And what does denigrating SPD in general have to do with motorcycle operation?

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

koorbloh

listen up, you twat, this is not hot topics.

stay on topic here. none of this shit is relevant to the motorcycles chosen for Seattle PD.

remove your head from your ass and try again.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

cletus

Yep, these guys look like terrible riders:



On a more topic related note, SPD's choice of bike is a bit strange given what one would think would be far more appropriate bikes, but the Harleys seem to suit their needs.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

WaGigKPN

Cant argue on comfort but every other criteria the Harley is hands down the worst bike...

i think a crown vic has better performance numbers!!!

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

FireDave

It IS on topic, is relevant. SPD is a messed up agency. Their choice of bike is yet another poor decision that exemplifies. Their primary parameters were handling and comfort. Not safety, not cost-effectivness for the tax-payers, not performance.

Handling? Read that as a bike they can handle, not that the HD handles well. Comfort? None of the bikes they tested are uncomfortable, unless you're a half-developed and bow-legged little mutant that has trouble with the high climb into a desk chair. I've done Monterey to Seattle in a day on my R12RT. Very comfy. If I were a moto-cop, my main parameters would be suspension and braking. Able to u-turn in my own bike length? Looks good at parades, might come in handy when you have to whip a u-turn in a one-way alley to bust a jay-walker. But I'd want to be able to stop, quickly, and have a suspension that can take what I throw at it. Who thinks of HDs when it comes to those crucial capabilities?


SPD has a very well-earned rep as dysfunctional. They've gone far out of their way to earn my contempt. Many, many stories to tell, but you probably don't want to hear them.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

sunofnun

Maybe the problem is your opinion of what makes up a "good/Skilled" rider?

I've been riding longer than you worked with them.. I doubt I'd think they were highly skilled.. but I don't thing most riders are highly skilled.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

Juilin

Heavily experienced and educated opinion noted. Hope you feel better now.

In the meantime, I couldn't care less what they ride as long as they're able to do their jobs appropriately. I'm sure choosing HD was undoubtedly 95% politics, but that's the way that shit works and always has. The city of Seattle just spent over a million on a fleet of Nissan Leafs. I opposed it and did my part but life goes on.

We need some more HEAVILY educated and EXPERIENCED people on these forums I tell you what. Nothing but AWESOME happens whenever they show up.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

FireDave

"Appropriately." Now there's a loaded term.

Let's see if we can define "highly skilled."

SPD: Can weave their bikes accurately through a bunch of cones, wow the crowd at a parade with "precision riding." But the real experts look at that parade performance and see many problems. Just like a Navy Blue Angel's pilot can look at an Air Force Thunderbird display and see many obvious flaws that a citizen can't even define, much less see.

I watch on-duty moto-cops on the street. Here's what I see with great frequency: Stiff arms, rigid wrists, target fixation, camping (riding for extended periods) in the blind spots and death zones near other vehicles, failure to stop the bike in a controlled manner, allowing traffic stops to occur at the worst possible location (with respect to on-coming traffic's ability to see and avoid them). Many other less obvious but no less bad riding. The real bikers, the observant ones, see these mistakes, over and over and over again. That's why we take the words of the defensive others like "highly trained" "expert" and "rigorous" with grains of salt. I don't disagree that they're highly trained and that for the weaker riders it's 'rigorous.' Probably a 50%+ majority are 'expert.' Plenty aren't.

Personal experience:

Told by an SPD moto-cop that I "lost control" of my bike when I simply chirped the tire on a steep downhill downshift. Yes, my use of the clutch was a bit abrupt and it was a slick cobblestone street near PP market. "I lost control? How long have you been riding, sir?" Yes, the conversation went very well after I asked that question.

Pulled over (on my bike) to a see if I could assist a dis-abled bike and biker. We were on 3rd Ave N.W. 200 yard visibility of traffic in either direction, narrow, no shoulder. I thought he was parked in a strange spot and he was on his cell phone. He'd run out of gas. An SPD moto pulled over to both of us. I'd recently, maybe a mile earlier, near Holman Rd and the school zone, ridden past (the cop was lidar-ing everything that passed him, including me). He pulls up to us, keeps his bike running and yells at us for blocking traffic. We weren't, btw, but SPD was at this point. The other guy was still on the phone, so I said, loud enough to be heard over traffic and his bike "he ran out of gas." Cop at this point turn off his bike, practically leaps off it, approaches me in a very aggressive manner and yells "Are you f-ing yelling at me? I could arrest you for obstructing an officer!" The two of us citizens did manage to calm him down . Two words dude: "de-caf."

Third: Southbound on Meridian Ave N, just north of 85th. I want to turn right, to go east onto 85th. I'm on my bike. An SPD moto-cop in front of me, with his right turn signal on, no emer lights, nobody pulled-over, he's just sitting there, in the middle of the lane, right at the crosswalk. He's had plenty of chances to make his free-right-on-red, but he's fiddling with his instruments or radio, or something. I give him (as short a beep as I can) on my horn, 'cause he doesn't know I'm back there and he doesn't appear recognize he's now holding up three other cars as well. He puts the side stand down, practically leaps off his bike. (SPD training for leaping off the bike appears to be well-attended) He comes storming back to me, yelling about illegal use of my horn, obstructing an officer (that training appears to be very mis-interpreted). I try to tell him that he's holding up traffic and appears to be oblivious to us (I mention the law about 'physical control' of the vehicle.) He goes OFF!. I just sit there, silent, bemused. Fortunate for me he can't see me smiling behind my FF helmet. When he's done yelling at me I take my helmet off and tell him I'm reaching for my phone. I call 911 and ask for this particular moto-officer's supervisor to come join us on the street. The present officer begins to go OFF again. This time he can see me smiling. I ask him to go sit on his bike while we wait for his boss. At this point I think he realizes I really did summon his boss and that I'm serious, patient and willing to wait. He goes back to his bike and shuts it off. 20 minutes later his Sarge or Lt or Capt shows up, listens to my version, listened to his, then proceeds to chew some moto-cop ass right in front of me. Now I'm really smiling.

I've got more, even quite a few where I can detail exemplary service, courtesy and professionalism from the SPD biker-boyz in blue. And before any of you decide this isn't on-topic: It is. I'm talking about biker's behavior, how they ride and their choice of bikes. The frequently displayed behavior, decision making and overall personality of moto-SPD on the street appears, yet again, to be in evidence by their choice of bikes. Sometimes I wonder if too many of them secretly wish they could change sides, watch "sons of anarchy" without guilt, become Outlaws or Nomads or something. Is that why they want Harleys?

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

seattleman

I can't stand Political Correctness, Environmental Whackos, an out of control EPA, and the "stupid" belief that we can do without Oil or Gas for the forseable future. I think that the Seattle Mayor's explanation of why spending so much on the more expensive Nissan actually saves money us pure bull.

However, maybe a fleet of reliable electric vehicles for Downtown use makes the most sense. Discounting pollution and price of fuel (there will still be a hefty electric bill), it seems that the type of driving required for Downtown patrols, plus the ability for nearly silent approaches at suspected crime scenes late at night makes "electric" the most sensible choice.

Having said that, why wouldn't a less expensive electric car have worked just as well? Politics, says I.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

WaGigKPN

You just had to present a perfectly logical reasoned argument to combat a liberal idea...Nice work...

Is there any hope for this thread now?

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

Darvax

That was pretty cool, well worth the watch.

On topic: I Disagree with the choice in bike, but to me it's a small fight. There are so many bad choices made by our governmental powers that this one is mostly irrelevant in my opinion. If its what the moto officers "really" wanted versus what their supervisors or mayor told them, I'm ok with it.

Now back to

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

cletus

You mean this:



It is the testing phase with a couple of departments including London, UK. Personally, and with the exception of highway patrol, county sheriffs, and more rural police departments that have to patrol long stretches of open road, I've never understood why police departments in congested urban areas tend to equip their officers with big bikes like the Harley, Victory, Honda, and Kawasaki. Given that city streets - especially in Seattle - are closer in nature to a motocross track, I've always thought a supermoto style bike would be ideal. They are quick, can go anywhere, and when Zero's bike gets through the testing phase, can be totally silent.

Like you said though, politics has far more to do with the bikes purchased than anything. Harley does a very, very good job marketing their police bikes and many of those on the government side with the power to pull the trigger on the deal, have only fuzzy idea of what tasks best suit a motorcycle.

As for FireDave, given your stated SPD experiences and comments thus far, I suspect you'd find reasons to rip Stoner's, Rossi's, and Lorenzo's riding technique if they were SPD moto-cops.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

Are_Six

Am I the only one who appreciates that they choose motorcycles with a top speed of 106 mph?

The WaStaPo machines worry me, so did the King County things, but their Moto unit got canceled.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

Juilin

Hope as a political pissing contest? Most definitely.

Might even get some good freelance internet cock measuring in too.

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

RC51

9 1/4"

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter

FlyingFinn

I hope to pick up one of the old SPD roadkings on the auction block before they get snatched up by greedy dealers.. anyone know when and where the are going to sell them off ...

__________________
Follow PNW Riders on Facebook and Twitter